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Synthetic Tsavorite
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Author:  Peter Torraca [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Synthetic Tsavorite

Check this out:

http://www.facetingrough.com/rough_synt ... rite.shtml

The page describes it as YAG-like, but without the Yttrium. I wonder if/how the lack of Yttrium affects the optical properties from an i.d./separation standpoint.

I also wonder how long this stuff has actually been available. Beware largish, exceptionally clean tsavos on eBay....

Author:  Barbra Voltaire, FGG [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:31 pm ]
Post subject: 

Curious.
Of course to be a synthetic tsavorite it must be chemically:Ca3 Al2 Si3 O12.

If it is anything else, it is an artificial product.
Does anyone want to research with facetingrough.com and ask them?

Author:  Jung Kee [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:34 pm ]
Post subject: 

Well, I don't have the formulas in my head, but isn't synthetic spinel something quite different from natural spinel in chemical formula, although still considered a synthetic?

Author:  red dirt [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:59 pm ]
Post subject: 

Here's a company that sells lab grown garnet.
http://morioncompany.com/Yttrium.htm

Author:  Peter Torraca [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:00 pm ]
Post subject: 

Jung Kee -- by definition, synthetic spinel has the same chemical composition as natural spinel. If it had a different chemical composition, it would be considered a simulant, not a synthetic. (This is true in gemology anyway; other fields may use the words "synthetic" and "simulant" differently.)

Barbra -- That's a good idea. I'll email Rob K. and see what he has to say. I've done business with him before and found him to be quite forthright and reliable.

Author:  Barbra Voltaire, FGG [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:04 pm ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
Well, I don't have the formulas in my head, but isn't synthetic spinel something quite different from natural spinel in chemical formula, although still considered a synthetic


As I understand, the ratios are different in natural vs. synthetic spinel, but the elements present are the same.
Natural spinel is MgAl2O4, which can also be written MgO Al2O3. In synthetic spinel the ratio is MgO to (5)Al2O3.

Author:  Peter Torraca [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:14 pm ]
Post subject: 

Thanks red dirt -- In digging through Morion's pages a little further, I found this: http://morioncompany.com/NewMaterials.htm Scroll down a little and note that they list the "emerald green" as GGG. I have no idea if it's the same stuff -- but I was surprised as how cloudy it looks in the images they supply.

Barbra -- I'm not a chemist, so I'm way out of my depth here -- but doesn't a different chemical formula mean a different structure and thus a different material? Is "synthetic spinel" more properly a simulant of spinel?

Author:  ROM [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:15 pm ]
Post subject: 

Barbra Voltaire wrote:
As I understand, the ratios are different in natural vs. synthetic spinel. Natural spinel is MgAl2O4, which can also be written MgOAl2O3. In synthetic spinel the ratio is MgO to (5)Al2O3.


Barbra, which type of syn. spinel are you referencing? Flame-fusion or the flux-grown type?

Rick Martin

Author:  Barbra Voltaire, FGG [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:16 pm ]
Post subject: 

flame fusion

The structure is closely related to sapphire, but with a closely packed arrangement of O layers, producing a cubic crystal.

"Synthetic" spinel was stumbled upon while experimenting with flame fusion synthetic sapphire.

Author:  ROM [ Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:23 pm ]
Post subject: 

pt wrote:
note that they list the "emerald green" as GGG. I have no idea if it's the same stuff -- but I was surprised as how cloudy it looks in the images they supply.


Well gallium and gadolinium certainly aren't yttrium. When you write Rob why don't you ask him what the properties of his new "tsavorite" are? His copy about the stuff seems carefully wiggle-worded.

Rick Martin

Author:  jleb [ Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:51 am ]
Post subject:  color-write

I live about .25 mile/3 min from Rob's shop. I've gotta get my loup back and i'll ask him about/pickup some of this material when I go over tomorrow. Should be interesting..

Author:  Barbara O. Ellis [ Tue Sep 26, 2006 12:21 pm ]
Post subject: 

You only have one loupe? :shock:

Author:  George Sharen [ Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Tanzanion

PT:

Thanks for the link on Tanzanite and Tanznion. :)

I have copied the stats on the two "gems " to my "book" :) Now I can test for the artificial if I see it.

The "book" eventually gets copied to a "flash card" that goes into a rolidex.
:D
As on gets ah .. more mature ... one needs memory aids lol

Thanks again

Author:  jleb [ Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:  the loup

it's one of those 30mm diameter or so Schneider loupes... I kinda like it.. cause it's big... here's the link...

http://www.kassoy.com/ls10.html

I have others, but kinda like looking through a straw after that one..

Author:  Peter Torraca [ Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:55 pm ]
Post subject: 

Actually Wolf, that sounds like a pretty good idea. What info. actually makes it to one of your index cards? How do you organize them?

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