I bought a ring with a large brown stone which I thought could possibly be cats eye. I gemologist has checked and said while it has good chatoyancy he thinks it is only tigers eye. while I can find info on chatoyancy in tigers eye I can't find anything on the milk and honey effect. any good websites that can help me. i have added some photos with my cats eye and the tigers eye certainly behaves the same way.
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Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:40 pm
Site Admin
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:22 pm Posts: 21602 Location: San Francisco
When you say the gemologist thinks it is tigereye, you really mean he identified it as tigereye, right? What is the stone in the ring surrounded by diamonds?
There is a reason that tigereye is listed as a substitute for cymophane, and it's sure not the cheap cabochon-grade stuff they're talking about. That's a very nice stone, but I have never seen a chrysoberyl with such a deep brown. In fact, there was a time that tigereye was a rare and valuable stone in its own right, before the extensive finds in Africa.
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:13 pm
Established Member
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:28 am Posts: 18
hi no the note included says "think" and don't think it is worth spending a lot of money on.the other stone with diamonds is chrysoberyl cats eye. I thought the milk and honey effect was when one side is honey and the other side is milky and when turned they reverse.
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:43 pm
Established Member
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:28 am Posts: 18
when light is behind the stone the side closet to me is milky when turned around it is the same. moves the diamond tester two bars just like the chrysoberyl. where chalcedony only moves one bar - so appears harder than another 7 hardness gemstone
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:23 pm
Site Admin
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:22 pm Posts: 21602 Location: San Francisco
Hi Sue. This is one of the reasons why instruments like "diamond testing" reflectometers can not be trusted to positively identify anything, even diamonds. The instrument you are using is not measuring actual hardness, it is measuring the reflectivity of the surface. Certainly harder stones can be polished to have superior reflectivity, but that isn't always the case. It is unlikely that your brown stone is chrysoberyl, but not impossible. Brown catseye chrysoberyl does exist.
as does brown fiber optic glass:
Microscopic observation coupled with a refractive index would be definitive.
Where do you live? Maybe one of our members could help you out.
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:44 pm
Established Member
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:28 am Posts: 18
thank you, I completely understand about the diamond tester issue - find the info on reflectivity interesting - as my tigers eye has lost its polish and is still a bit flat. the jeweller gave it a quick polish in the setting and it is a lot better but still needs work - he doesn't consider the stone being worth spending much on. really want to know if tigers eye can exhibit the milk and honey effect - which I thought my photos showed quite well. tried it with two light sources last night and the eye split in two. even as tigers eye it would never have been a cheap ring as it is 18ct and weighs 11.6gms
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 12:01 am
Site Admin
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:22 pm Posts: 21602 Location: San Francisco
Well, I guess it depends on the criteria we are using to define "milk and honey". The stone in your ring is unusually chatoyant for a tigereye. But it could still be tigereye:
Rather than speculate on hypotheticals, as I mentioned earlier, positive identification is not difficult for one with the right instruments and the training to properly use them and interpret results. Bring it to someone who is willing to spend the 5 minutes it would take to identify your unknown.
If you lived in SF, I'd say hop in the car and drive over...........
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 12:21 am
Established Member
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:28 am Posts: 18
my understanding of the milk and honey effect was with the light behind the closest side is cloudy -other side translucent when turned cloudy side becomes translucent and translucent becomes cloudy.
yes I fully understand the problems with speculating and will get a second opinion. just looked at so many websites on tigers eye to find out more about it. there is a lot of info on chatoyancy but can't find any on the milk and honey effect - just thought you guys may point me in the right direction. does your tigers eye have the milk and honey effect - ie swaps over when turned with the light source behind it. thank you for the offer would love to take you up on it but would be a very long flight.
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 11:09 am
Gold Member
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:29 pm Posts: 1047 Location: Paris
You seem to be more focused on your milk and honey effect rather than on the mere beauty of your stone, I wonder why. It could very well be neither tiger eye nor chrysoberyl by the way, a good deal of stones can display chatoyancy with or without milk and honey effect. Just show your stone to someone who will be able to examine it properly under magnification and will take the refractive index, as Barbra says 5 min will be enough. You will lose less time than trying to get an exhaustive documentation about milk and honey.
Post subject: Re: tigers eye milk and honey effect
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2014 1:42 pm
Gemology Online Veteran
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:48 am Posts: 584 Location: Odenton, Maryland
sue1961 wrote:
I bought a ring with a large brown stone which I thought could possibly be cats eye. I gemologist has checked and said while it has good chatoyancy he thinks it is only tigers eye. while I can find info on chatoyancy in tigers eye I can't find anything on the milk and honey effect. any good websites that can help me. i have added some photos with my cats eye and the tigers eye certainly behaves the same way.
Just for clarification, 'cats eye' (more properly, cat's eye effect) and chatoyancy are the same thing, and they describe a phenomenon found in many different stones. The word chatoyance actually derives from the French for 'cat's eye' (œil de chat). So to call your stone a 'cats eye' actually does not in any way identify it.
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