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 Post subject: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 4:12 am 
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Hello everyone,
A while back I purchased a Raytech base without a handpiece for use as a flat lap for cutting star sapphires. It works great for that purpose but I figured it would be fun to actually try faceting as well. A forum member was kind enough to point out the eBay auction for this piece, a handpiece by the unheard-of German Alge company (which I am fairly certain is the short-lived Alge Fertigungstechnik, which existed from 1998-2002).
For the most part it seems to be intact and working, pretty standard design with a 64 index gear. It is made to accept 6mm dops. However, for the life of me I can't figure out how it's supposed to actually hold a dop. This is what the front looks like:
Image
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Image
You would think that that set screw would go through the... uh, hollow shaft that holds the dop (sorry don't remember the term) but it actually just holds the shaft itself in place. The shaft has a 6mm diameter a ways in and then narrows probably to about 3, and the end is notched.
I am thinking of just replacing the shaft with a completely new one with a set screw, since it's easy to remove, but I'm not sure if I'm missing something obvious here.

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 7:44 am 
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I have 2 images I got from a german faceter but files are too big. do you hav an e-mail address at hand to send them to ?

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Martin


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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 11:57 am 
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It is either missing a piece or is not meant for normal dops. I would suggest one of these: https://szfable.en.alibaba.com/product/ ... nd_64.html $225 shipped and it takes 1/4" dops (you may have to bore out the collet a little as they are a tight fit).

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:18 pm 
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capcuadrate wrote:
I have 2 images I got from a german faceter but files are too big. do you hav an e-mail address at hand to send them to ?

regards
Martin

Send the pics to me and I'll get them uploaded.
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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 3:02 pm 
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Stephen,
How odd it would be that there is a machine listed on ebay that may be the same hand piece. Here is the eBay item number:162333560141. Based on this listing these dop pins are the same dop pins I use on my Jang machine. A threaded rod holds them in place and the small pin fits in the notch.
Greg

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 3:04 pm 
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The threaded rod slides through the index gear side and screws into the dop pin.
Greg

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:18 pm 
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Thank you very much! I have now gotten two great emails thanks to your contacts and I understand it now. I suspect it's going to be hard to source that kind of dop, so I'll probably go ahead and set about figuring out how to have a replacement shaft made to hold dops. On the plus side, if I can do it I should be able to make it take both .25 inch and 6 mm dops just by switching out the shaft, which could be handy.

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2017 3:39 am 
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Dear Stephen,

its kind of a historical piece and maybe it would be a pity to change it. As I mentionend by e-mail these dops are used on some automatic machines probably and maybe they can be found from someone in Idar Oberstein.There is also Steinfroilein on this Forum who might know something.

Happy newyear by the way.

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:03 am 
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The company ALGE formerly EDUS (Erich Dern und Söhne) was closed after the death of Mr. Kretschmer.
Wilfried Neumann, a former employee of ALGE, bought the stock and from 1997 until his death in 2008 he continued with the given plans to build the machines.
In the meantime there is only known a nephew from Mr. Neumann who tried to sell the last 4 machines in the last few years.

I will send a mailadress from this nephew to Stephen.
Maybe he can help.

Wish you all a happy and faceted new year 2017.


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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:37 pm 
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capcuadrate wrote:

Dear Stephen,

its kind of a historical piece and maybe it would be a pity to change it.n

It's true that it's quite neat, but the replacement I'm thinking of making wouldn't be a permanent change to the head--the old shaft could be slotted back in just as easily as it can be slotted out. It would definitely be cool if I could find dops that would fit, and I suspect it wouldn't be unworkably hard to make my own now that I know how it works, but it seems like it might be more economical to make or have made one part that would make it work with more easily-acquired dops. It's definitely going to take a bit of thinking through though!

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 7:54 am 
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Hi Stephen,

just saw this

http://www.ebay.de/itm/162341931244?ul_noapp=true

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:02 am 
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Sorry to bring up a dead thread but I've been researching these handpieces and can't find anything so I'm hoping that I might learn more here.

I was already said, ALGE was the continuation of the products of EDUS.

I know that EDUS was around in the 1940's because Mr Imahashi saw them in the 40's and was inspired to make his own faceting handpiece.

Im trying to figure out when EDUS started. Any one have any clues? info? links? books?

I Have a illustration from 1850 of a profile view of a handpiece that looks just like an imahashi handpiece from Geneva so maybe EDUS was continuing an idea that already exists before. It seems fairly obvious that these handpiece designs originally came from Diamond Tangs but I am wondering when... Trying to figure it all out :)

Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:00 pm 
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I have seen a mechanical faceting handpiece that is currently used in Idar-Oberstein fashioned from wood and varnished.
I attempted to find a photo using Google to no avail.

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:35 am 
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Let me know if you find it, I'd love to see. Also let me know if you have any contacts in Idar-Oberstein that use this type of machine. Everyone I know uses jamb peg so they know nothing about the history and use of the handpiece type machine.

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 Post subject: Re: German handpiece (Alge Fertigungstechnik)
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:47 am 
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Maybe you could ask the machine makers in Idar. They are long enough in business to have known Alge.
http://www.homberg-und-brusius.de/index.html
http://www.ottoeigner.de/html/maschinen/seite3.html

Martin


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