January 24 Through February 4—TUCSON, ARIZONA: Annual show
Welcome to the GemologyOnline.com Forum
A non-profit Forum for the exchange of gemological ideas
It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 5:31 am

All times are UTC - 4 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 1:46 pm 
Offline
Valued Contributor

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:29 pm
Posts: 214
I've been cutting on a used Raytech-Shaw for a few years now, completing maybe forty stones from 2 to 20mm and 0.07 to 30 carats.

It's dawned on me that the thing simply isn't repeatable, and I'm wasting a huge amount of time checking facets; 9/10ths of my polishing time is just getting on plane.

So should I send it in for a refurb, buy a new one, or upgrade to a better machine with a mast?

Are new Raytech-Shaw's even truly repeatable???

Thanks for any advice!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 4:15 pm 
Offline
Valued Contributor
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:00 pm
Posts: 391
Location: Dolan Springs, Arizona
Back in 2004 Don Rogers wrote a article on tuning up faceting machines including the raytech shaw models. It's quite detailed and may be of help to you. It's available for downloading at Lapidaryworld.com. I know that at the time Don was the only source for repairing raytech shaw models which were out of production at the time and selling for next to nothing.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 4:20 pm 
Offline
Valued Contributor
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2012 6:15 pm
Posts: 101
Location: Greer, SC
It is more than likely wear in the quill that holds the dop. It is a little loose to start with but with time wears to the point you can't get the same result every time. I found over .015 play with mine. Replaced the quill with a piece of stainless steel tubing that was the right OD and had the ID reamed to .002-.003 clearance. Fixed things right up. Marsh Howard of Lightning Laps made a quill with collect ends and this took up the play when you tightened the dop. This problem can be fixed without buying a new machine.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 5:42 pm 
Offline
Moderator: Lapidary Diamonds
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 11:32 pm
Posts: 1747
Location: Florida, United States
That's a design flaw in Raytech Shaw machines. I had one back in the 1980's and the quill was loose when new and became looser with use. You can fix it with the methods suggested by other posters in this thread. If a machine has such flaws consistently over many years, it never really got out of the beta prototype stage and should never have been offered on the market. I sold mine after getting fed up with that issue and others.

_________________
http://adamasfacet.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2017 11:59 am 
Offline
Valued Contributor

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:29 pm
Posts: 214
Very interesting, I hadn't heard of the collet problem before, thanks all!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:31 pm 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran

Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:33 am
Posts: 840
Location: Mars PA
I have posted about the repeatable nature of the Raytech-Shaw before, but here is my world of faceting.

I started faceting in 1962 on a machine I bought from Shaw, who had just started manufacturing it a few years before. For the next five years I cut a very limited number of stones. When I bought the machine my mother made me take lessons from Shaw and others before I could spend all my money. I was taught to find the facet, that had been cut by setting the appropriate angle/index and then release the front foot. I continue to do this, but I never depended on its level of repeatability, like I have read about for a modern high quality mast and boom machines.

When I really got back into faceting nearly 20 years ago, I found the original Shaw machine to be inadequate for the faceting I wished to do. It was very light weight and I did not have more than one index which was an interesting hybrid. So I needed to buy a new machine. I again chose the intuitive freedom of the platform facetor despite its weaknesses.

I have read about the effort people have put into the facetor to make it more repeatable and I admire them, but I have shaped my faceting world to accommodate it. I do not use multiple stage polishing like diamond in favor of a one step oxide polish. I adjust my meets by polishing and the depth of my facets, that should be limited by the table setting, have very little use for me. Finally I polish on a stationary lap and I see the effect of the twisting caused by different speeds of the cutting lap and my legs on the hand piece are not square to the table. One thing I do use, that was not supplied and addressed in the past is a leveling tool that I use to be sure the hand piece is parallel to the laps in the beginning. The old way was to tighten up the feet to level the hand piece, but the condition of my legs, from being pushed across the table, are too bad. In fact I abrate the table with the legs and I sure it is not as flat as it should be.

So how do I get anything done?. I cut relatively simple cuts and I find it both a challenge and glory to adjust the machine by eye for all the things that need to be right on any faceting machine to be repeatable. I still feel that the adjustments you can make on the machine are highly intuitive, you would hope so for me after so many years faceting, and it can produce a sense of control and creativity I enjoy. Am I fast, NO, could I ever win a contest NO, but that is not what I value in faceting. What I can do is create a very personal stone, that matches the best that the most modern faceting machines can make in simple cuts, by eye and in beauty, in my opinion. I leave the quest for perfection in the hands of others.

Bruce


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: raytech-shaw isn't repeatable, what to do?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:32 pm 
Offline
Valued Contributor
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 4:08 pm
Posts: 381
Location: Lyon, France
One solution might be to buy a new handpiece to go on your base. Immahashi's are the best but very expensive (maybe around $1000 for a new handpiece) but I think you can get a well made Sri Lankan clone for a few hundred. I'm about to buy 8 Sterling machines from Sri Lanka for our new school. Similar to Raytech as far as I can tell. I visited the factory in colombo and I like the machines and especially for the price. Sterling has a new handpiece with a cheater which is kinda cool.

http://www.sterlinggemland.com (not sure why but they don have a pic of the handpiece on the site but I have a few pics if you want to see the one with the cheater and also the one without)

Picture:
https://imgur.com/a/yhbFw

_________________
Gentleman Lapidary, Author, Gem Dandy, Faceting Instructor
Book > http://www.magusgems.com
Gemcutting/Gemology Articles > http://www.justinkprim.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 4 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 28 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Gemology Style ported to phpBB3 by Christian Bullock