CIBJO releases Gemmological Special Report: considers process of separating measurable facts from opinion; See Gemological Articles below.
Welcome to the GemologyOnline.com Forum
A non-profit Forum for the exchange of gemological ideas
It is currently Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:30 am

All times are UTC - 4 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:48 pm 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran

Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 2:18 am
Posts: 645
One of my students has an early UltraTech machine with no provision for a Keyed Dop. As is normal with students they are not able to cut fast enough to finish either a pavilion or crown in one session. He is getting increasingly frustrated aligning the stone each time he removes it from the machine. He sees the students with more recent Ultra Techs or Facetrons freely taking their stones out and putting them back in. It often takes him the first 1/2 hour and help aligning his stones. It is really expensive to have Ultra Tech update his machine, and he is thinking he will have to buy a facetron head instead. He really cannot afford to do either.

I think I remember that there was at one time a chuck setup that one could buy for the older Ultra Techs that would provide an affordable keyed solution for the early machines.

I can not find any of these for sale on-line. Anyone here have any information, or sourcing help with this?

Most appreciated,

Steve


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 12:03 am 
Offline
Active Member

Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2010 1:23 pm
Posts: 80
Location: San Luis Obispo County, CA
How about using something like the Ultra Tec girdle aligner? He can attach it to the stone before he removes it from the machine at the end of one session and then use it to align at the start of the next.

(Can't say I have tried it myself. But then it is a long time since I was learning.)

_________________
Mary M. Rafferty
http://gems.vistagrande.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 1:42 am 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 22, 2010 2:51 am
Posts: 698
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
The older Ultra Tec machines have a chuck with a Morse taper. The dop is held in the chuck with a set screw. The chuck can be removed with an eccentric key (photo below), and has an external pin to realign it when reinserted. I had one of the chucks of my older Ultra Tec modified by a machinist who drilled through it and inserted a transverse pin (see the black spot on the taper in the second photograph) so that it could align the newer keyed Ultra Tec dops, which have a bevel at the rear end. You can grind a bevel on the end of each dop. It doesn't have to be precise. If you have only one chuck this will solve the problem.
Attachment:
Ultra Tec key.jpg
Ultra Tec key.jpg [ 100.39 KiB | Viewed 418 times ]

Attachment:
UT chuck 1.jpg
UT chuck 1.jpg [ 69.55 KiB | Viewed 418 times ]

Attachment:
UT chuck 2.jpg
UT chuck 2.jpg [ 248.6 KiB | Viewed 418 times ]


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 2:58 am 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran

Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 2:18 am
Posts: 645
Thanks Duncan!

Yes, What Duncan has posted is what I remember from back in the day. Anyone know where I can buy one of these?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 9:29 am 
Offline
Moderator: Lapidary Diamonds
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 11:32 pm
Posts: 1738
Location: Florida, United States
1bwana1 wrote:
Thanks Duncan!

Yes, What Duncan has posted is what I remember from back in the day. Anyone know where I can buy one of these?


eBay

_________________
http://adamasfacet.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 9:31 am 
Offline
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2008 4:01 pm
Posts: 1868
Location: Pine City, NY and Dothan, AL
vistagrande wrote:
How about using something like the Ultra Tec girdle aligner? He can attach it to the stone before he removes it from the machine at the end of one session and then use it to align at the start of the next.

Good idea. Marsh Howard (Lightning Laps) has these for sale. I cant see them on his website, but he had them at the recent Franklin Faceter's Frolic. You can contact him at sales@shop.lightninglap.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 12:28 pm 
Offline
Valued Contributor

Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2016 7:58 pm
Posts: 163
Location: San Marcos, CA
Steve,
FYI if I remember correctly this system didn't make the dops keyed, just the collet has a pin. On transfer you still have to remove the dops from the collet. Although it better than nothing. I had an old Stanley v2 that had this system, the key Chuck's are extremely hard to find and when you do they are normally well worn out and will not push the collet enough to free them and many times I needed heat to free it from the mast. I'm sure a good machine shop can make the check keys. The last I spoke with UT they didn't have any of the parts for this system, they will upgrade it and then it was around 800$.
Anyway just food for thought

_________________
The Gem Garden
San Marcos, CA


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2019 1:02 pm 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran

Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 2:18 am
Posts: 645
Thanks guys.

I didn't like this system that well back in the day either.

I am thinking of just drilling through the existing quill and inserting a pin like the later models. Sort of like Duncan showed in his tapered collet. That way he can use the newer dops with the 45 angle on them. Anyone ever heard of this being done?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:48 pm 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 22, 2010 2:51 am
Posts: 698
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
1bwana1 wrote:
I am thinking of just drilling through the existing quill and inserting a pin like the later models. Sort of like Duncan showed in his tapered collet. That way he can use the newer dops with the 45 angle on them. Anyone ever heard of this being done?

Hi Steve - How is the dop secured in the quill of an older UT without a chuck? As far as I know, all the older ones took a Morse tapered chuck. The newer quills have a locating transverse pin built in, and secure the dop with a set screw. The older models also had a different table adapter than the more recent ones (see photos - newer on the left, older on the right). The older has a Morse taper and the newer one just slides onto the quill. Perhaps a photograph of the element you want to alter would help in providing better advice.
Attachment:
Table fixtures 001.jpg
Table fixtures 001.jpg [ 24.36 KiB | Viewed 342 times ]


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:10 pm 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran

Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 2:18 am
Posts: 645
In class, he is cutting with the schools machines. At home he is using one very old one he bought used that he says has no provision for keying. He is bringing it in next Wednesday. I will take pictures, and maybe we can figure something out.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:46 am 
Offline
Gemology Online Veteran
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 22, 2010 2:51 am
Posts: 698
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
The chucks on the old Ultra Tecs allowed you to remove and replace your stone accurately when cutting the table, pairs, suites, or when more than one person was using the machine. The chucks were keyed, not the dops. This did not allow for a keyed alignment on transfer, because the transfer jig took the dops, not the chucks.

The modern Ultra Tecs have a transverse pin in the quill and bevelled dops, that allow accurate re-alignment of the dop if it is removed, and accurate alignment after transfer if you use a suitable transfer jig that enables alignment of the bevelled dops. (You do have to make sure that the interior of the quill is kept clean and the bevel seats properly on the pin in the quill.)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Ultra Tech Question
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:56 am 
Offline
Valued Contributor

Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:12 pm
Posts: 114
1bwana1 wrote:
In class, he is cutting with the schools machines. At home he is using one very old one he bought used that he says has no provision for keying. He is bringing it in next Wednesday. I will take pictures, and maybe we can figure something out.



I never used this type of machine,but just an idea,maybe as a temporary solution , you can mark the dops and create some kind of an arrow mark on the quill which then can be used to align the dop to the machine. at roughly the same spot every time.
when the mark on the dop will be parallel to the mark on the machine, you will have some indication where it was the last time the dop was locked in to the quill. not precise,but better than nothing.

_________________
https://www.facetquality.com


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 4 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Gemology Style ported to phpBB3 by Christian Bullock